That is not true. If Limblah paid cash he paid a LOT more than if he had insurance. The poorest get hit the hardest if they don’t have health insurance because they pay top dollar for medical services. They don’t get discounts like people covered by insurance do. You said you are no expert and that is obvious. And if you had done even a miniscule amount of research you would have discovered that those who pay cash pay the highest rate of any other group. So if Limblah said he paid less he is LYING AGAIN. Insurance companies only pay a percentage of each claim. Patients who don’t have health insurance pay the full price for each procedure.

That is why there are more than a MILLION bankruptcies every year due to medical costs, and conservatives seem to love it when their fellow citizens lose their retirements, their homes and their lives.

Over 43,000 Americans die every year because they can’t afford medical care and have no health insurance. Only 3,000 died on 9/11, but republicans spent over a trillion on a war against a country which had NOTHING to do with the 9/11 attacks and NOTHING to do with terrorism. Why don’t these same soulless conservatives give a damn about the 43,000 people dying every year because they don’t have access to medical treatment. And DON’T say they can all go to emergency rooms to get treatment. That is a DAMNED LIE. By the time anyone gets to emergency rooms they have advanced diseases which are usually terminal.

Conservatives have no souls and they are the most anti-Jesus, anti-human creatures in existence. They are driven by hatred, greed and racism. I wonder what the parents did to their children to produce soulless conservatives, with no empathy and no compassion?

To agree or disagree whether a relatively small increase in health costs over the next decade is an acceptable trade-off completely misses the point of having a government that uses deceit and outright lies suggesting the opposite of this report just a few weeks ago, in order to pass legislation that will be a catalyst in the economic collapse of our country. I have righteous anger Rick when my daughter will live in a nation in which taxes and fees to corrupt governments are more than earnings kept, and there seems to be nothing I nor other “angry” citizens can do about it..

For the record, I think I outlined some things that could absolutely decrease health care costs in my previous posts, which suggests I have at least more of an understanding than some of the idiots in Washington, but I would be obliged to get a quick education that you may can share with your audience, save the talk on forced insurance requirements which will be impossible for private insurance companies to comply with. In fact, if you have a different post or reference site,that outlines any of these things for better or worse, I’d be happy to read it. However there is no way anyone could ever convince me that this law will do anything except speed up the demise of the American ecnonomy and US dollar, by a runaway government which has lost its ability to understand sound economic principles.

The reason you are reading it first on The Guardian is because it is a British news paper, which means they publish quite a few hours ahead of American publications because of the time difference. If you paid attention to most stories, of any nature, you will discover this to be true.

I would suggest that you might want to read the actual HHS report which says that the costs of health care may go up 1% over the next decade. The report also states that the law will result in providing health care to over 30 million new people.

Personally, I find a 1% increase over a decade to be a very conservative estimate as I imagine it could easily go up more. If you take off your political hat and look at it medically, you will find that there are likely to be advances in technology and drug therapy over the decade which will save lives but at a cost.

I have never argued that the new health care law will lower the cost of health care. Try reading all my posts on this and you will find it is clearly the case.

You should try losing a bit of the anger (which is nothing but taking the easy way out) and get a little smarter on what this law really did – for better or for worse. If you’re interested, you should spend some time on what really causes increased medical costs – not what politicians tell you. You might find you will be a lot smarter.

Final thoughts and response.. I wonder if liberals told their supporters to read more and bitch less during the Bush years or years during Republican rule of Congress… yeah I bet they did.. If more people would ‘bitch’ when it counted, our nation wouldn’t be on a crash course toward collapse..

It’s nice to see that we actually agree on much of what i consider would have been common sense steps to change health care in America in a more responsible way, but Rick, if you’ve consulted with lawmakers, why couldn’t these issues that we agree on be made the focus? It goes back to my previous statement, this was never about providing coverage to those without insurance.. in fact you agree with me in another of your posts I see.. that a single payor system is inevitable.. government run health care system, that is if the nation’s economy lasts so long.

I didn’t criticize you for any statements that support common sense and reasonable steps, so not sure why you thought i did, but regardless, your statements regarding all the things that were voted out by Republicans are disingenuous, first because they were merely part of the larger bill that was ultimately passed. These things were never considered as standalone ‘baby steps’ toward resolving the problem, so to strip out parts of a massive bill was a worthy effort and did not affect the ultimate outcome. And FYI the Democratic caucus held a Filibuster proof Senate for the first year and some change of the Obama admin. That some of the Senators and Representatives (very few) still believe they should represent THEIR constituents, speaks well of those who went against the train that ultimately ran over the concept of our Republic.. but perhaps this will be corrected in November. It’s interesting to note the way Democrats have to operate in order to get what they want. Clinton did it too. Push through the things that you don’t have support for, as early as possible, and take the heat on the midterms. Hopefully if you can screw it in early enough, Americans will have forgotten. If it were my choice, I’d say it was time to get rid of all the entrenched powers in Washington, Republican and Democrat, and start over, but that isn’t realistic..

As for this Health Care Act and every other government power grab that comes from this administration you so admire, perhaps those of us who have means will survive just fine, at least until our riches are destroyed in value or confiscated by the type of government you seem to want. Perhaps it will take an economic collapse and confiscatory actions by a tyrannical government before all the wealthy do-gooders realize their mistake, but unfortunately by that time it will be too late for going back and when that happens, whether we have Health insurance or not, will be the least of our worries.

Peace

For starters, might I respectfully suggest you spend a little more time reading a bit less bitching. You would be surprised to find that I have, on this very page, written in support of almost every item you have suggested.

1. Revamp or expand Medicare to cover the uninsured.

Love it. I would have expanded Medicare to be available to anyone who wants to buy into it based on higher rates for those under 65 and based on earnings. You may recall that this was proposed but came to an end when every Republican in the Senate plus Joe Lieberman said they would filibuster the idea. With every Repub plus Joe against it, the measure fails.

2. Address the overcharges, and billing practices by hospitals and care providers,

Completely agree. This is where you need to read the new law rather than listen to the nonsense. While I agree it doesn’t go far enough to lower costs, it does at least begin to address physician & hospital payment schemes and incentives. If you take the time to read some previous posts, you might consider the difficult issue of over testing where we all want it to be minimized…unless it is me or my family. In that case, test away! It is a difficult issue and not easily resolved in sound bites.

3. Address the pricing structures and distribution practices of pharmaceutical companies which charge 10 times more for a product here, than they do in markets abroad.

Completely agree- although it is a bit more complicated than you state it. Still, you will find that I have written in opposition to the deal Obama made with the drug companies. On this issue, I hold the Dems. as much to blame as Repubs. as they are all on BigPharma’s payroll.

4. Reform Tort law so it prevents abusive and costly lawsuits and liabilities which have a direct impact on care providers costs.

Completely agree. I’m on record as calling for state medical reviews before a malpractice case is permitted to go to trial in a court of law. The problem isn’t as big a chunk of the overall problem we face (malpractice ligitation accounts for 2% of the total healthcare expenditure) but I agree we can do this better and in a way that protects physicians from undue lawsuits.And, by they way, I am not a trial lawyer. And, again, it is definitely on the Dems.to step on to this issue as the trial lawyers have too much control over Democratic votes.

5. Put qualifications on individuals to take part in their own health by practicing responsible behavior, instead of rewarding them, I mean, why not make those who purposely abuse themselves and drive up costs for everyone, pay more for their health needs?

Again, agreed. Here’s the problem. It is difficult to make an assessment of charges at the time of illness. There are people who are going to have heart attacks even thought they work out and don’t smoke. So, how do you assess who has-and who has not- adequately taken care of themselves. The only practical way to do it is to tax products that we know make people unhealthy. We know that sugar and corn products cause diabetes, etc., etc. Yet, when the idea of a sugar tax is proposed, the bottling industry goes crazy and their GOP protectors shoot it down. I know taxes is a dirty word, but this is the only practical and pragmatic way to accomplish what you suggest.

6. Encourage competition in the health insurance industry by allowing it nationally.

If I’m not mistaken, you criticized me in your first comment for my saying this is fine.
The thing is – it won’t work. Medical costs vary from state to state. An insurance company pricing policies in Indiana are not going to offer the same policy in California for the same price. That said, it is certainly okay with me if they want to try.

Finally – name one Republican? The Dems. are in control? You’re kidding, right? I assume you’ve been paying attention and heard of that pesky little problem called the filibuster?

I actually, via my last post, made an effort to seriously engage. I really was looking for what baby steps you would suggest. I’ve re-read your latest comment a number of times and, somehow, I cannot seem to find even one such suggestion.

Your point about the reform being failing to deliver on cost savings is pretty much correct. Gee— I wonder if the Republicans might have had anything to do with that and all the other lost provisions that actually would have had an impact on the issues you raise? It would be my great pleasure to send you copies of the bills that didn’t make it. While I suspect that you will simply say something pithy about how you don’t read 2000 page bills because……blah,blah,blah, you’d be surprised what was in them.

Retorting that insurance companies cannot make money because of gov’t interference is…well…it certainly makes the point that you hold your brain in high regard, you truly don’t know what you’re talking about. But please, don’t take my word for it. Spend some time with some health insurance CEO’s as I do. Listen to what they have to say.

Finally – and I say finally because while I invite you have to have last word- I’m pretty much done with you, while you write reasonably well, havng the facts will always prove more useful as does the ability to see another side’s point of view. You’re so busy telling me who I idolize and making other snide remarks about what yout think you understand about my positions, that you contribute little beyond anger stated in nicer sentences.

Tell you what, why don’t you use some of your inevitable retort to actually tell us what it is you would do with the system rather than take shots? If you say something intelligent, then we can have a debate -because making nasty Obama references, etc. just doesn’t get there, even if your Jewish and like expresso.