Comments on: Calling out MoveOn.org on Afghanistan

By: golikehellmachine

golikehellmachine — Thu, 08 Oct 2009 10:06:35 +0000

This is nonsense. Subjecting the children of the wealthy to a draft is no better than the children of the poor making up the majority of the voluntary military. You’re essentially saying, “Since it’s mostly the poor dying in these wars, let’s throw some rich bodies into graves, too”, which undermines the entire point of the anti-war effort. It may feel nice and satisfying to condemn an entirely different demographic to PTSD, amputations, death and the like, but it’s equally deplorable.

By: Brian In NYC

Brian In NYC — Mon, 01 Jun 2009 17:07:51 +0000

I’ve seen nothing from the president to indicate that he’s rethinking his 16 month commitment to ending our involvement in combat operations in Iraq.

This member (since it’s founding) of moveon.org would be very disappointing if we abandoned the people of Afghanistan to the Taliban. And your characterization of moveon.org “pre-eminent anti-war voice of the past 8 years” just doesn’t jibe with the facts. From moveon’s web site:

“The MoveOn Peace campaign was founded independently by Eli Pariser, a Maine native and recent graduate of Simon’s Rock College of Bard. In the days following September 11th, 2001, he launched an online petition calling for a restrained and multi-lateral response to the attacks, which was quickly signed by more than half a million people.”

In case you hadn’t realized our involvement in Afghanistan is of a multilateral nature, though not as much as I or the president would like to see. As I said I find your take (and Mr. Hayden’s) and expectation of moveon to be just wrong.

By: Michael Hastings

Michael Hastings — Mon, 01 Jun 2009 16:08:11 +0000

Brian, the point is pretty clear–that the pre-eminent anti-war voice of the past 8 years has been silent on Iraq and the escalation in Afghanistan since Obama took charge. It’s a point that Tom Hayden made, and I riffed off.

We are not going to be out of Iraq in 16 months; the Army just announced plans to keep a significant number of troops there until at least 2019. MoveOn’s was fairly strident in their criticism of Petraeus–they haven’t said peep about him since he’s become Obama’s general.

MoveOn isn’t pacifist, but it’s not pacfist to question the rationale behind sending tens of thousands of more Americans, and spending billions of more dollars, to Afghanistan. It just means you’ve read a couple history books on what happened to the last two empires who decided to spend a good chunk of time in Central Asia. And, as I said, if McCain had won(we can safely assume that his policy would look pretty much like Obama’s now)MoveOn would still be fundraising off the anti-war vote.

The larger point is that the last two elections have been referendums on the Iraq war, yet the Iraq war is nowhere near ending. That is a choice. An order, not a magic wand is needed. Obama could end the war pretty quickly if he wanted to, but the military is advising him to take even more time, and spend another decade in Iraq.

By: Peace and Justice Movement Pulled a Rumsfeld–It’s Time to Recover « Get Afghanistan Right

Mon, 01 Jun 2009 15:16:06 +0000

[...] to our agenda following our successful toppling of the opposing regime. With evidence mounting that MoveOn has thrown in with the militarists on Afghanistan, with the preferred presidential candidate of the anti-war movement now busily expanding one or two [...]

By: Brian In NYC

Brian In NYC — Mon, 01 Jun 2009 14:53:52 +0000

Obama promised to end war in Iraq in 16 months. We’re 4 months into his presidency and we are reducing the troop count. I frankly don’t understand the point of your piece of Michael. Did you think the president was going to wave a magic wand on Jan. 21st and the troops would start pouring out of Iraq? The president is living up to his campaign promise on this issue, and I think you’re characterization of moveon.org is just wrong.

By: Michael Hastings

Michael Hastings — Mon, 01 Jun 2009 11:49:09 +0000

Points taken Brian, though MoveOn came to prominence because of their anti-war stance. And what have they delivered to their base? A war in Iraq that’s still going on, and a new and improved war in Afghanistan.

By: Peace and Justice Movement Pulled a Rumsfeld–It’s Time to Recover « Return Good for Evil

Sat, 30 May 2009 18:12:59 +0000

By: Jeff McMahon

Jeff McMahon — Sat, 30 May 2009 07:01:05 +0000

You make an important point about the draft, Michael. It’s necessary not just to affect the anti-war folks in visceral ways, but a fair and equitable draft would also put the children of the wealthy at risk. Imagine how peaceful we might become then. And whoulda thunk it: that 40 years after the burning of draft cards, it would become clear that peace might be served by a draft.

By: Brian In NYC

Brian In NYC — Fri, 29 May 2009 23:44:09 +0000

Obama campaigned on stepping up the effort in Afghanistan. Moveon.org is not an anti-war organization, it’s a liberal political action committee that was formed in response to the attempt to impeach Bill Clinton. Being a liberal does not mean you’re a pacifist.

By: Michael Hastings

Michael Hastings — Fri, 29 May 2009 22:55:25 +0000

Laurie, Joseph–thanks for weighing in.

It’s sort of perplexing. MoveOn got its power from its antiwar stance, and we all know if McCain had won, they’d still be very vocal about Iraq/Af/Pak.

MoveOn surely helped the Dems win in ‘06 and BHO in ‘08, thanks to the antiwar feel. But those two electoral wins have left us with…two ongoing wars…So they helped get the Dems elected on the war, but haven’t been able to actually do anything more than that. The Dems, w/o having their feet held to the fire as JC say, have reverted back to their safe pro/war-status quo political fetal position, where they hid from ‘01 to ‘04…Until it was safe to be against the war w/o actually doing anything about it…