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	<title>Comments on: Does &#8220;The Hangover&#8221; portend patriarchy?</title>
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	<link>http://trueslant.com/markstricherz/2009/06/06/does-the-hangover-portend-patriarchy/</link>
	<description>Politics, Culture, and the Church</description>
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		<title>By: Mark Stricherz</title>
		<link>http://trueslant.com/markstricherz/2009/06/06/does-the-hangover-portend-patriarchy/comment-page-1/#comment-98</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Stricherz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Jun 2009 18:12:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://trueslant.com/markstricherz/?p=287#comment-98</guid>
		<description>Oh, OK. Fair enough. Sorry.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh, OK. Fair enough. Sorry.</p>
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		<title>By: Brian In NYC</title>
		<link>http://trueslant.com/markstricherz/2009/06/06/does-the-hangover-portend-patriarchy/comment-page-1/#comment-94</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian In NYC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Jun 2009 00:55:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://trueslant.com/markstricherz/?p=287#comment-94</guid>
		<description>Mark I was responding to zd comment, not to your post.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mark I was responding to zd comment, not to your post.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Stricherz</title>
		<link>http://trueslant.com/markstricherz/2009/06/06/does-the-hangover-portend-patriarchy/comment-page-1/#comment-93</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Stricherz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Jun 2009 20:27:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://trueslant.com/markstricherz/?p=287#comment-93</guid>
		<description>This post said nothing about homosexuality. At all.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This post said nothing about homosexuality. At all.</p>
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		<title>By: Joseph Childers</title>
		<link>http://trueslant.com/markstricherz/2009/06/06/does-the-hangover-portend-patriarchy/comment-page-1/#comment-92</link>
		<dc:creator>Joseph Childers</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Jun 2009 02:44:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://trueslant.com/markstricherz/?p=287#comment-92</guid>
		<description>That&#039;s a good point - as far as it goes.  However, I did come across a person who seem to poke a couple dozen holes in his argument from a statistical angle:

http://stevereuland.blogspot.com/2006/03/one-baby-two-baby-red-baby-blue-baby.html

As much as it seems fishy to me, though, I can&#039;t pretend to have the background to really examine it...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s a good point &#8211; as far as it goes.  However, I did come across a person who seem to poke a couple dozen holes in his argument from a statistical angle:</p>
<p><a href="http://stevereuland.blogspot.com/2006/03/one-baby-two-baby-red-baby-blue-baby.html" rel="nofollow">http://stevereuland.blogspot.com/2006/03/one-baby-two-baby-red-baby-blue-baby.html</a></p>
<p>As much as it seems fishy to me, though, I can&#8217;t pretend to have the background to really examine it&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Stricherz</title>
		<link>http://trueslant.com/markstricherz/2009/06/06/does-the-hangover-portend-patriarchy/comment-page-1/#comment-91</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Stricherz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 08 Jun 2009 22:00:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://trueslant.com/markstricherz/?p=287#comment-91</guid>
		<description>Joseph,

Longman anticipated your first point. In the third to last paragraph of the article, he wrote

&quot;To be sure, some members of the rising generation may reject their parents&#039; values, as always happens. But when they look around for fellow secularists and counterculturalists with whom to make common cause, they will find that most of their would-be fellow travelers were quite literally never born.&quot;

To be sure, the young voted overwhelmingly for Obama last fall, so that fact weakens Longman&#039;s thesis. But their support for a culturally liberal candidate may well be the exception not the rule. After all, until 2008 the youth vote never really delivered for Democrats, as its original supporters acknowledged later.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Joseph,</p>
<p>Longman anticipated your first point. In the third to last paragraph of the article, he wrote</p>
<p>&#8220;To be sure, some members of the rising generation may reject their parents&#8217; values, as always happens. But when they look around for fellow secularists and counterculturalists with whom to make common cause, they will find that most of their would-be fellow travelers were quite literally never born.&#8221;</p>
<p>To be sure, the young voted overwhelmingly for Obama last fall, so that fact weakens Longman&#8217;s thesis. But their support for a culturally liberal candidate may well be the exception not the rule. After all, until 2008 the youth vote never really delivered for Democrats, as its original supporters acknowledged later.</p>
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		<title>By: Brian In NYC</title>
		<link>http://trueslant.com/markstricherz/2009/06/06/does-the-hangover-portend-patriarchy/comment-page-1/#comment-90</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian In NYC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 08 Jun 2009 17:28:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://trueslant.com/markstricherz/?p=287#comment-90</guid>
		<description>As a gay man I marvel at the power assigned to me by the far right!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As a gay man I marvel at the power assigned to me by the far right!</p>
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		<title>By: Joseph Childers</title>
		<link>http://trueslant.com/markstricherz/2009/06/06/does-the-hangover-portend-patriarchy/comment-page-1/#comment-89</link>
		<dc:creator>Joseph Childers</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 08 Jun 2009 12:51:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://trueslant.com/markstricherz/?p=287#comment-89</guid>
		<description>You&#039;re right.  I definitely should&#039;ve qualified that statement more.  I was talking about specific regimes that are hostile to women&#039;s rights, and I shouldn&#039;t have painted the entire region with that brush.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You&#8217;re right.  I definitely should&#8217;ve qualified that statement more.  I was talking about specific regimes that are hostile to women&#8217;s rights, and I shouldn&#8217;t have painted the entire region with that brush.</p>
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		<title>By: zdroberts</title>
		<link>http://trueslant.com/markstricherz/2009/06/06/does-the-hangover-portend-patriarchy/comment-page-1/#comment-88</link>
		<dc:creator>zdroberts</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 08 Jun 2009 05:46:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://trueslant.com/markstricherz/?p=287#comment-88</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m not defending this movie&#039;s morals in any way, but seriously? It&#039;s a R-rated film about a bunch of guys going on a romp about Vegas that would make Hunter Thompson cringe. It&#039;s fucking hilarious.

But as Mark didn&#039;t even seem to bother viewing the film and seemingly only read a review in the Wash Post... I&#039;m not sure what the point of this article is. Did you even watch the trailer Mark?

I&#039;m terrified what your book on &quot;the breakdown of the American Family&quot; is going to be like. But I&#039;m sure you&#039;ll somehow blame it on the cinema and probably &#039;the gays.&#039;

Go back to the Wash Times and leave teh interwebs to people who actually read and watch what they review.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m not defending this movie&#8217;s morals in any way, but seriously? It&#8217;s a R-rated film about a bunch of guys going on a romp about Vegas that would make Hunter Thompson cringe. It&#8217;s fucking hilarious.</p>
<p>But as Mark didn&#8217;t even seem to bother viewing the film and seemingly only read a review in the Wash Post&#8230; I&#8217;m not sure what the point of this article is. Did you even watch the trailer Mark?</p>
<p>I&#8217;m terrified what your book on &#8220;the breakdown of the American Family&#8221; is going to be like. But I&#8217;m sure you&#8217;ll somehow blame it on the cinema and probably &#8216;the gays.&#8217;</p>
<p>Go back to the Wash Times and leave teh interwebs to people who actually read and watch what they review.</p>
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		<title>By: paquettems</title>
		<link>http://trueslant.com/markstricherz/2009/06/06/does-the-hangover-portend-patriarchy/comment-page-1/#comment-87</link>
		<dc:creator>paquettems</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 08 Jun 2009 05:41:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://trueslant.com/markstricherz/?p=287#comment-87</guid>
		<description>You know, I was right there with you. I was agreeing with everything you said. Then you went crazy.

Why did you feel the need to pull the Middle East into a completely unrelated subject? You went from a very accurate and intelligent critique of the point raised to completely discrediting yourself by spouting off some ignorant BS. I mean, if you don&#039;t like the Middle East I am totally cool with that. Don&#039;t get me wrong. But come on...really?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You know, I was right there with you. I was agreeing with everything you said. Then you went crazy.</p>
<p>Why did you feel the need to pull the Middle East into a completely unrelated subject? You went from a very accurate and intelligent critique of the point raised to completely discrediting yourself by spouting off some ignorant BS. I mean, if you don&#8217;t like the Middle East I am totally cool with that. Don&#8217;t get me wrong. But come on&#8230;really?</p>
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		<title>By: Joseph Childers</title>
		<link>http://trueslant.com/markstricherz/2009/06/06/does-the-hangover-portend-patriarchy/comment-page-1/#comment-85</link>
		<dc:creator>Joseph Childers</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 07 Jun 2009 22:20:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://trueslant.com/markstricherz/?p=287#comment-85</guid>
		<description>There are a couple holes in Longman&#039;s thesis that I can spot even from a casual reading.  

First, there&#039;s his assumption that children monolithically adopt the values of their parents, or conservative religious parents always give birth to conservative religious kids and vice-versa.  If fertility rates equaled religious growth rates, Amish, Seventh-Day Adventists, Jehovah&#039;s Witnesses, and others would dominate the American landscape.  But the defection rates are very high, and just because patriarchal parents have more kids, it doesn&#039;t follow that they&#039;re popping out more lovers of patriarchy.  

Second, he flatly states that population equals power (even in the modern world) more than other factors.  Well, obviously since countries like Rwanda, Afghanistan, Palestine, and Rwanda with the highest birth rates are clearly poised to rule the world and conquer slack breeders like  Japan, the US, and the UK, he&#039;s right on the money there.  Not to mention the inevitably of Utah and Alaska overtaking New York, etc.  

Also, his thesis relies on a time when patriarchy was violently secured as the ruling value, an advantage it had over more egalitarian states.   You can&#039;t force patriarchy anymore, except in the Middle East, and aside from security issues, I don&#039;t think we have to fear fundamentalists overtaking us.  They&#039;d have to get out of the stone age first.  

I have more to say about your grafting all of these assumptions onto a lighthearted comedy, but right now, dinner&#039;s on.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There are a couple holes in Longman&#8217;s thesis that I can spot even from a casual reading.  </p>
<p>First, there&#8217;s his assumption that children monolithically adopt the values of their parents, or conservative religious parents always give birth to conservative religious kids and vice-versa.  If fertility rates equaled religious growth rates, Amish, Seventh-Day Adventists, Jehovah&#8217;s Witnesses, and others would dominate the American landscape.  But the defection rates are very high, and just because patriarchal parents have more kids, it doesn&#8217;t follow that they&#8217;re popping out more lovers of patriarchy.  </p>
<p>Second, he flatly states that population equals power (even in the modern world) more than other factors.  Well, obviously since countries like Rwanda, Afghanistan, Palestine, and Rwanda with the highest birth rates are clearly poised to rule the world and conquer slack breeders like  Japan, the US, and the UK, he&#8217;s right on the money there.  Not to mention the inevitably of Utah and Alaska overtaking New York, etc.  </p>
<p>Also, his thesis relies on a time when patriarchy was violently secured as the ruling value, an advantage it had over more egalitarian states.   You can&#8217;t force patriarchy anymore, except in the Middle East, and aside from security issues, I don&#8217;t think we have to fear fundamentalists overtaking us.  They&#8217;d have to get out of the stone age first.  </p>
<p>I have more to say about your grafting all of these assumptions onto a lighthearted comedy, but right now, dinner&#8217;s on.</p>
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